PSA - MS3B and Our Creations
Feb. 27th, 2011 06:36 pm
aikea_guinea posting in club_crimsyn
This is a bit of a PSA just to let everyone know that we’ve asked that our creations no longer be posted to My Sims 3 Blog. This is something we’ve been mulling over for several months now, and have finally decided we’ve had enough of the douchebaggery that goes on in the comments over there. It’s not so much things said about our creations (gelydh never reads the comments on our stuff, and I only very rarely), but more about what goes on in other people’s uploads. We don’t want our creations associated with that sort of environment.
People who create CC are not slaves. We all may have very different motivations for what we do, but none of us owe anything to downloaders. Quite frankly, we're disgusted by how many (not all, but many) TS3 players treat CC creators. The amount of entitlement is beyond anything we saw for TS2. It’s one thing to expect perfection from something you’re paying for, but being nitpicky assholes about free items is appallingly rude. It’s ok to say things like ‘These are pretty nice, but they’d be even better if you added some ground shadows to them.’ The person who made the ground-shadowless thing doesn’t have to do anything to their creations, but I promise you they’ll be much more likely to take your suggestion seriously if you’re not a complete fuckwit about it.
What we've seen with the release of TS3 is no-one being safe from over-the-top criticism, regardless of whether or not they charged for their creations or gave them away for free or, as is the case with Club Crimsyn, paying half out of our own pocket for the upkeep of the site - we actually lose money and haven't cared up to this point! I'm not sure just how much longer we're willing to put up with this shit. Even at TSR we could post things and get genuine feedback without having to worry about it being torn to shreds just because someone felt like being a dick that day. We aren't in any way, shape, or form advocating paysites or TSR; it just really says something when we realize that free TS3 creators are being treated far worse than pay TS2 creators ever were.
Do the people who say shit about creations because they’re bored realize the potential consequences of what they’re doing? We’ve seen more than one creator quit because of the idiocy displayed recently. Helaene, one of our favorite creators from the very earliest days of TS2, recently stopped uploading because of trolls on her site. Quite frankly, we can’t really blame her. There’s been more than one occasion where we’ve found ourselves wondering what the point of uploading anything was because it was just being nitpicked to death, and we were used to that sort of thing from when we were paid creators on TSR.
We make custom content for TS3 because we feel like things are lacking in our own games. We think, 'We could really use some new hair textures/female clothes/rabid squirrels,' and we proceed to make said thing. If we don't like how said thing is turning out, we give up and wander off to attempt to make another thing. Eventually, we do manage to finish something, and we may or may not get a weird tickle in our brains that says 'Maybe someone else would like to have this,' and if Finished Thing isn't missing any major parts, we'll toss it on here for other people to use if they want.
This may come as a surprise, but we honestly don't care one bit if you use something we make or not. Chances are, we won't ever see your game, so we flat out won't know one way or the other. Therefore, saying something like 'If you did X to this, I'd download it' is pretty pointless. Again, constructive feedback is fine, and appreciated, but even then we won't necessarily do anything more to an item once it's finished. People are always welcome to do whatever they want to things we upload (aside from the obvious no paysites thing, and no claiming you did something we did), so feel free to have at it. You can do X to thing Y til your eyes bleed if it'll make you happy.
We’re always glad when people appreciate the things we upload, and a simple 'thanks' goes a very long way in making us want to continue sharing stuff. This may sound like it contradicts the above paragraph, but even though we don't care if you don't download something we make, it's still nice to know when it's appreciated.
In closing, I was just shown this Dilbert, which seems fitting, so I now share it with you:
(Note the date. You’re not doing anything even remotely new or original.)
I realize how pointless this all is, but damn it, I’m posting it anyway even though I know it won’t change a damned thing. I’m OK with that. Because fuck you, that’s why.
People who create CC are not slaves. We all may have very different motivations for what we do, but none of us owe anything to downloaders. Quite frankly, we're disgusted by how many (not all, but many) TS3 players treat CC creators. The amount of entitlement is beyond anything we saw for TS2. It’s one thing to expect perfection from something you’re paying for, but being nitpicky assholes about free items is appallingly rude. It’s ok to say things like ‘These are pretty nice, but they’d be even better if you added some ground shadows to them.’ The person who made the ground-shadowless thing doesn’t have to do anything to their creations, but I promise you they’ll be much more likely to take your suggestion seriously if you’re not a complete fuckwit about it.
What we've seen with the release of TS3 is no-one being safe from over-the-top criticism, regardless of whether or not they charged for their creations or gave them away for free or, as is the case with Club Crimsyn, paying half out of our own pocket for the upkeep of the site - we actually lose money and haven't cared up to this point! I'm not sure just how much longer we're willing to put up with this shit. Even at TSR we could post things and get genuine feedback without having to worry about it being torn to shreds just because someone felt like being a dick that day. We aren't in any way, shape, or form advocating paysites or TSR; it just really says something when we realize that free TS3 creators are being treated far worse than pay TS2 creators ever were.
Do the people who say shit about creations because they’re bored realize the potential consequences of what they’re doing? We’ve seen more than one creator quit because of the idiocy displayed recently. Helaene, one of our favorite creators from the very earliest days of TS2, recently stopped uploading because of trolls on her site. Quite frankly, we can’t really blame her. There’s been more than one occasion where we’ve found ourselves wondering what the point of uploading anything was because it was just being nitpicked to death, and we were used to that sort of thing from when we were paid creators on TSR.
We make custom content for TS3 because we feel like things are lacking in our own games. We think, 'We could really use some new hair textures/female clothes/rabid squirrels,' and we proceed to make said thing. If we don't like how said thing is turning out, we give up and wander off to attempt to make another thing. Eventually, we do manage to finish something, and we may or may not get a weird tickle in our brains that says 'Maybe someone else would like to have this,' and if Finished Thing isn't missing any major parts, we'll toss it on here for other people to use if they want.
This may come as a surprise, but we honestly don't care one bit if you use something we make or not. Chances are, we won't ever see your game, so we flat out won't know one way or the other. Therefore, saying something like 'If you did X to this, I'd download it' is pretty pointless. Again, constructive feedback is fine, and appreciated, but even then we won't necessarily do anything more to an item once it's finished. People are always welcome to do whatever they want to things we upload (aside from the obvious no paysites thing, and no claiming you did something we did), so feel free to have at it. You can do X to thing Y til your eyes bleed if it'll make you happy.
We’re always glad when people appreciate the things we upload, and a simple 'thanks' goes a very long way in making us want to continue sharing stuff. This may sound like it contradicts the above paragraph, but even though we don't care if you don't download something we make, it's still nice to know when it's appreciated.
In closing, I was just shown this Dilbert, which seems fitting, so I now share it with you:
(Note the date. You’re not doing anything even remotely new or original.)
I realize how pointless this all is, but damn it, I’m posting it anyway even though I know it won’t change a damned thing. I’m OK with that. Because fuck you, that’s why.
no subject
Date: 2011-03-13 05:57 am (UTC)I just recently became aware of your stance on having your creations featured on MS3B. I truly understand and applaud your statements here. I have for a long time seen this coming and it really makes me sad. Joe and I correspond by e-mail sometimes and this has been the topic, yes it's discouraging. I think the anonymous posters that are mean post that way because they want to protect their identity when they don't really contribute nothing positive to the comment section. Sometimes I think they are jealous, petty artists in the community that don't get enough attention, or even (gasp) some suck butt, idiotic, goatse queen from the drag you down pay site. Don't need to name names, do I?
I am the poster called "B" on that blog and I am middle aged. I wondered if my being irritated by the awful comments was because of my impatience with immaturity, seems that the younger posters enjoy that type of idiocracy. Being a part of the sims community since 2005, I always enjoyed reading comments on creations as a form of information, seeing if everything works right and looks as well as the preview pictures in game. If I installed the creation and had problems, I want to give feedback to help others too. That is not the atmosphere at MS3B. I have to muddle through all the crappy comments to gleam any information that is useful to me, and when I give praise for something someone shares with the community, I am labeled a kiss-ass. Hmm... that is hilarious to me.
I am a huge fan of both of your work, Aikea and Gelydh. I am so glad you are still available and haven't quit. I am so disappointed in the community running away Heleane, I absolutely adore her and the work she shared. Oh well, I have to do things the old fashion way, go around on my own and check my favorite artist work. No problems, my bookmarks include this site too. :) See you all around.
no subject
Date: 2011-03-13 06:10 am (UTC)I'm also middle-aged (*sigh*), and I know exactly what you mean. I've been a part of this 'community' since 2004 as well. I don't remember things being this bad, and everything you've said is spot-on. (And holy shit will that woman ever quit?!)
If you even thought about defending someone (or even if you were just making a snarky, unrelated comment, as gelydh did once) on MS3B, you were called out for 'white-knighting.' The whole thing just bored me to tears. Maybe my sense of humor is different, but we couldn't stand it anymore.
Glad you've bookmarked us. I know I've always appreciated your comments on our work. :)
PSA - MS3B and Our Creations
Date: 2011-03-16 05:51 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-03-16 03:41 pm (UTC)People are assholes no matter where you go
Date: 2011-03-16 05:29 pm (UTC)I don't blame you guys one bit for asking to have your stuff not posted on MS3B anymore. Those of us who appreciate your work (raises hand) know where to find you guys.
Great rant and love the cartoon ;)
--Caliena
no subject
Date: 2011-03-19 06:13 pm (UTC)i'll say now that i am usually a lurker, but you guys are definitely my favorite makers, and i appreciate all your content so, so much. there's not a sim/home i make that doesn't use at least one thing one of you made, because all your creations are fantastic. so thank you, and i hope by keeping away from ms3b you won't be associated with all that awfulness. ):
no subject
Date: 2011-03-19 08:03 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-03-27 10:03 am (UTC)I so completely understand your decision about MS3B. I rarely read the comments over there, because each time I do, I end up with a "but why do I bother at having a site?"-moment. Anyway, MS3B is handy to discover new sites, but yours is one of the very rare sites I visit regularly, even without MS3B, anyway, and I'm sure it's the case of most of the people. Shame on me to not have said that before! (and shame on me to not have updated my links page since *cough*august 2009*cough*, because if I did, your site would be in my favorites in all the categories!)
Sandy
no subject
Date: 2011-03-27 06:23 pm (UTC)I don't get it either...
Date: 2011-04-20 07:09 pm (UTC)Ignore the HATERS!!!
Date: 2011-05-21 01:17 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-11-02 10:07 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-11-15 12:21 am (UTC)That said, I also want to actually say something more on topic about this post. MS3B is about the only thing that's stopping me from sharing my own creations. I've been viciously attacked before by anons in other communities, and I'd do anything to keep myself from having to go through that torment again. So I'm very torn. There are so many things I want to make (and maybe convert from TS2) because I want them in MY game and I know other people would think they were cool. I mean, I've even downloaded all the tools to mesh. But then I think about the absolutely horrible way people act when they're allowed to be anon, and I get scared all over again. And I just don't know if the custom content is even worth it.
Aaannywaaays, sorry for the TL;DR. And thank you so much for the things you share. Always remember that despite the douchenozzles with entitlement issues that are gradually taking over the CC-downloading population, there are still some nice people that love and appreciate what you do, and who will always be willing to TELL you so whenever asshats get you down or angry. You are not alone (and that goes for ALL CC creators, actually).
Also: while I will dearly miss Helaene and RD (their creations, as well as them), I really can't blame them for deciding that it's not worth the trouble.
♥ Sarah [My tumblr (http://hesladyfabulous.tumblr.com), because I can't use it for OpenID and my LiveJournal account is pretty much dead.]
no subject
Date: 2011-11-15 12:31 am (UTC)I really hope you decide to jump into creating and sharing! At the very least, you can do the same thing we did and ask that your items not be featured, or even ask that commenting be disabled on your entries as I've seen a few other creators do. Like you said, CC isn't worth the frustration of dealing with anons, but also there are a lot of really great people in this community that make sharing things worth every effort.
Anyway, your timing on this comment was pretty good since I've been thinking about how much happier I am sharing things now that I don't have to deal with the idiocy over on MS3B. :D
Ass Wipes.
Date: 2012-01-05 05:00 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-03-26 05:09 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-04-25 04:03 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2012-08-01 09:38 pm (UTC)